Kona vs. Nice: A Comprehensive Analysis of Elite Triathlon Fields plus Long Slow Distance: The Key to Endurance Success?
In this discourse, we delve into the imminent Ironman World Championships, highlighting the remarkable caliber of the athletes poised to participate in both Kona and Nice. The episode elucidates the final participant lists following the recent Ironman events in Kalmar and Copenhagen, showcasing an impressive lineup that includes multiple past champions and formidable contenders. Furthermore, we confront the disconcerting updates surrounding the T100 organization, which has faced significant challenges, including the cancellation of a scheduled race due to financial mismanagement. In a thought-provoking segment, we analyze a recent study that posits the efficacy of long, slow distance training for endurance athletes, sparking a critical dialogue on the implications of training intensity and volume for competitive success. Through these discussions, we aspire to furnish our audience with insightful perspectives on the evolving landscape of triathlon and the intricacies of athletic preparation.
Links to topics discussed:
The TriDoc Podcast
Matt's Instagram
Jeff's Instagram
Email Jeff: tri_doc@icloud.com
Email Matt: Matt@thetemponews.com
Signup for the Tempo News
Signup for The TriDoc Podcast Supplement form
Transcript
Welcome to Tempo Talks, a show that brings you analysis of the biggest stories in triathlon training, tips to make you a better athlete, and breakdowns of the latest science and performance.
Speaker A:I'm Matthew Sharp, an Olympian in triathlon 70.3 Champion & Co founder of the Tempo News.
Speaker B:And I'm Jeff Sankoff, the tridoc medical contributor for Triathlete magazine, age group winner and coach at Life Sport Coaching.
Speaker B:Our goal, inform and entertain two perspectives.
Speaker B:One sport, all things triathlon.
Speaker B:Now let's get into it.
Speaker B:Hello.
Speaker B:Hello, everyone, and welcome back to another episode of Tempo Talks.
Speaker B:I am Jeff Sankoff, your co host.
Speaker B:And I am joined by the very relaxed, appearing somewhat in between races, not sure where he's going next, my partner in crime, Matt Sharp.
Speaker B:Matt.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:We are a little all over the place.
Speaker A:I'm figuring it out still.
Speaker B:I am.
Speaker A:I'm floating a bit.
Speaker A:For sure.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Come to Marbella.
Speaker B:Come, come to Marbella.
Speaker A:I know it's definitely Costa del Sol.
Speaker A:I know it's definitely, it's definitely trending, I feel in that direction a bit.
Speaker A:Like one thing, I think we talked about this.
Speaker A:Do you know the course?
Speaker A:Have we seen the course yet?
Speaker B:No, no.
Speaker B:I have no idea why I haven't looked in the last week.
Speaker B:Maybe something has changed.
Speaker B:But this, the last I checked, it was still not out there.
Speaker B:And I find it incredibly annoying that they can't put it out.
Speaker A:It's crazy.
Speaker B:It's a little frustrating.
Speaker A:Like I was looking, I guess maybe previous course or something.
Speaker A:It's a hilly course, which definitely is not in my favor in a lot of ways.
Speaker A:Although maybe there's still quite a bit of time before then to actually get the watts per kilogram, I guess in a good place, in a better place.
Speaker B:It's not like you don't live in a hill.
Speaker A:Exactly, exactly.
Speaker A:Exactly.
Speaker A:And there is some Runway.
Speaker A:So I like having the Runway.
Speaker B:Yeah, that's for.
Speaker A:So for me, I feel like definitely still in the cards for sure.
Speaker B:All right, I'll see if we can beg, plead, cajole and see if we can't get you over there.
Speaker B:I'm actually pulling up the site right now to see if they have posted a course because like you, I'm very interested to know.
Speaker B:Especially it's not like I'm gonna.
Speaker B:It's not like I'm gonna change anything in my training.
Speaker B:I'm going one way or the other.
Speaker A:Absolutely.
Speaker B:But it's still, it's no, still not.
Speaker B:Nothing on the swimming, nothing on the bike, nothing on the run.
Speaker B:And we know the run will be flat because it's going to be or at least I assume because it's the Marbella course has a run that goes along the seashore.
Speaker B:I assume it'll be similar.
Speaker B:And then it's just the bike.
Speaker B:The bike is normally not a particularly hilly course but my understanding is there, there is the option to have.
Speaker B:It could be some good climbing.
Speaker A:Yes, absolutely.
Speaker B:We'll see.
Speaker B:We'll see.
Speaker A:I feel.
Speaker A:Let's go through today's topics.
Speaker B:Yeah, we have a good show on tap.
Speaker B:I think we are going to talk about.
Speaker B:Speaking of World Championships, we are going to talk about the final lists for the Ironman World Championships.
Speaker B:That was finally settled after this past weekend's Ironman's in Kalmar and in Copenhagen.
Speaker B:We are then going to follow up with the latest sort of, I don't know, poor T100.
Speaker B:They get one week of good news, one week of not so good news.
Speaker B:So we're going to talk about the latest sort of downswing in the news for the T100 and then we're going to finish up with a study that Matt brought to my attention and I think it's something that will be of interest to all the age groupers listening.
Speaker B:And it was something that Alex Hutchinson, someone who I have a great deal of respect for, he published sort of a synopsis of this study on outside and he talks about new evidence that long slow distance is the key to endurance success.
Speaker B:Far be it for me to disagree, but I disagree.
Speaker B:We'll get to that when we have our conversation in the latter part of the show.
Speaker B:But let's begin with what looks to just be star studded cast of characters showing up in Kona and Nice.
Speaker B:I guess we should begin in Nice because that falls first on the calendar.
Speaker B:The men's field is not to be trifled with despite the fact that my personal favorite Lionel will not be there.
Speaker A:Unfortunate for Lionel fans across the world.
Speaker B:My boy Matthew will be there.
Speaker B:And who's he going to be?
Speaker B:Who's he going to be contesting?
Speaker A:It's just a class field star studded like you said.
Speaker A:You have Christian Blumenfeld, who I guess I would say is the presumptive favorite given his unbeaten streak in the last four races.
Speaker A:But then of course you have three other returning Ironman world champions who all seem to be coming into great form themselves as we get closer to the race.
Speaker A:You've got Gustav Iden.
Speaker A:He had a tough year last year and seems to have been trending up throughout this year.
Speaker A:You've got Patrick Lange, who had some early season injury struggles, couldn't race at Ironman Texas, but since then has been on a roll.
Speaker A:It seems like he's back to full health, full strength.
Speaker A:And then of course Sam Laidlow, another early season injury, health issues, not really ever confirmed.
Speaker A:I feel like, I guess low energy whatnot.
Speaker A:Did we ever get a confirmation on what it was?
Speaker B:Nah.
Speaker B:But you know what, I feel pretty confident that it was just over training and he just needed some time to recover.
Speaker B:That's.
Speaker B:I think we had it right and he just was casting about with frustration and eventually he just recovered and came back really strong and I'm really happy to see that.
Speaker B:And the thing about Kristian, I always say don't bet against Kristian until he proves that he's not going to win.
Speaker B:We've seen this before where guys peak too early and then are they able to sustain it through the end of the year.
Speaker B:Now Kristian hasn't really raced at the same kind of volume that he has sometimes in the past.
Speaker B:So he's clearly going to be coming in, I think looking pretty fresh and it'll be.
Speaker B:It's going to be amazing.
Speaker B:Patrick, remind me.
Speaker B:I. Patrick did pretty well when it was in Nice.
Speaker B:I remember him having a little bit of struggle on the bike, but he really ran his way up on the run and finished, I believe in the top three at last time.
Speaker B:It was there.
Speaker B:It was something like that.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:He was second, I believe in Nice.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker A:Because he really like didn't lose a crazy amount of time where which maybe he could have versus the rest of the field.
Speaker A:He just ran out of real estate for Sam.
Speaker A:Laid low.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Really is what it was.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:He was coming and he was just Sam.
Speaker B:Sam just so strong on the bike.
Speaker B:He was able to put a big gap.
Speaker B:But that's the thing.
Speaker B:Nice really favors the strong cyclists and so we are looking at some.
Speaker A:Just believe you mentioned a strong cyclist before, Matthew Marquardt.
Speaker A:He is an absolute beast on the bike.
Speaker A:You also have Magnus Ditlevo, who himself again like just absolute monster on the bike and who.
Speaker A:Someone who.
Speaker A:I think he had success in Nice.
Speaker A:I think he actually was he second in Nice that year.
Speaker A:Maybe he was third.
Speaker A:I think he was third.
Speaker B:I think he was third.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:And those guys can both run.
Speaker B:They've established themselves as really solid runners and Matthew is a stronger swimmer arguably than all of those guys.
Speaker B:If he can not have cramps in transition, that sets him back.
Speaker B:He's in a good position to come out and actually be part of A lead pack.
Speaker B:It is.
Speaker B:I am not looking, looking forward to the fall.
Speaker B:I am clinging to summer with every tendril.
Speaker B:I love my summer.
Speaker B:And we're lucky here in Denver or in Colorado because it'll be warm pretty much through October.
Speaker B:But still, I don't like to see summer disappear.
Speaker B:And yet at the same time, this is something that I am really looking forward to.
Speaker B:I think it's going to be really a spectacular event and just amazing.
Speaker B:An amazing day in the foothills of the Mediterranean.
Speaker A:Yeah, like, those guys are all like you talked about, the great cyclists.
Speaker A:A guy like Rudy von Berg also there who he would.
Speaker A:He was fourth when it was a nice.
Speaker A:I believe.
Speaker A:Then last year was third in Kona.
Speaker A:So he's like doing these steps in the ladder and maybe he's someone who.
Speaker A:If Blumenfell has a bad day, he's in the periphery.
Speaker A:I think he grew up in that area too, so has a lot of familiarity with the roads, with the technical descents and everything.
Speaker A:Yes, he certainly set himself up for another great race there as well.
Speaker B:So we are like what, 2, 3, 3 ish?
Speaker B:Just about a month.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Because we're recording this on the 20th.
Speaker B:So we have 11 days left in August and then 14, so about 25 days.
Speaker B:So will those guys be getting to France now or will they be getting in two weeks ahead?
Speaker B:What is the pro athlete kind of version of this?
Speaker A:Yeah, I think before Kona, you see those guys get their like maybe two weeks before, ten plus days before this.
Speaker B:One, but that's a heat.
Speaker A:Exactly.
Speaker A:So there's no factor there.
Speaker A:I think you're going to see them at least 10 days still out getting on that bike course, checking out the climbs, getting comfortable with all the twists and turns on the descents as well.
Speaker A:I think they're going to be there pretty early just to mostly scope out the bike.
Speaker A:Like it's really so much about the bike in this race and for some.
Speaker B:Of them also, it'll be a jet lag thing.
Speaker B:So anybody like Matthew coming from the United States, he's got a.
Speaker A:Will his crews arrive in Nice in time?
Speaker B:He's going to take the Queen.
Speaker B:He's going to take the Queen Elizabeth across and hey, it worked.
Speaker A:It worked.
Speaker A:He's got the magic.
Speaker A:They could just lock in on that cruise ship and hit the buffet.
Speaker A:No, no.
Speaker A:Thinking there.
Speaker B:Would be a real treat if he listened to this because he doesn't have him grief.
Speaker B:But at the same time, we are very.
Speaker B:Yeah, exactly.
Speaker B:We are very admiring.
Speaker A:Absolutely.
Speaker B:Let's switch over.
Speaker B:Let's Switch over to the women's side because as good as the men's field is, I almost wonder if the women's field isn't better.
Speaker B:It's just, it's amazingly deep.
Speaker B:I cannot remember a women's field where there's gotta be at least 10, maybe 15 women who could legitimately say they could possibly win.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:So who's lining up in comb?
Speaker A:It's incredible this lineup of women.
Speaker A:I think I said.
Speaker A:What did I say?
Speaker A:There's certainly four, at least four plus athletes who could take the win, maybe even five.
Speaker A:You've got three returning champions.
Speaker A:Laura Philipp from last year.
Speaker A:Nice.
Speaker A: cy Charles, Barclay from Kona: Speaker A: And then Chelsea Sadaro, Kona: Speaker A:Two of those three, Laura Phillip, Lucy Charles, they are certainly on for the win.
Speaker A:Chelsea, she's had great races in Kona obviously but maybe in that race in Kalmar it wasn't.
Speaker A:I guess for me she has not clicked.
Speaker B:She has not clicked on all self.
Speaker A:And maybe she just knew that all she had to do was validate so she kind of shut it down on the run.
Speaker A:I can get behind that.
Speaker A:And then she can get it back into the training pretty quickly.
Speaker A:It's one thing too having a bit of momentum as well.
Speaker A:But three incredible athletes.
Speaker A:And then from non champions you have Kat Matthews, Great Britain.
Speaker A:Another.
Speaker A:She had that battle with Laura Phillip at Ironman Hamburg.
Speaker A:It was like the newest version of the Iron War.
Speaker A:And we could see another one of those battles in Kona which would just be incredible.
Speaker A:Of course, Taylor Nib, another athlete who will be absolutely firing.
Speaker A:I think she's been focusing on just on this race this entire year.
Speaker A:Really.
Speaker B:Yeah, we've talked about that several times.
Speaker B:When you've mentioned that she looks like she's missing that top end speed from the T170.3 and you have opined that it may be because she's really putting in all the long distance stuff and really focusing on Kona.
Speaker B:So it'll be interesting to see what she does there because she did really well in her debut.
Speaker B:She did amazingly well.
Speaker B:And then Lucy.
Speaker B:Yeah, Lucy caught her on the run and then she ended up falling down to fourth.
Speaker B:But wow, pretty impressive what she did.
Speaker B:And then we've got Julie Darin.
Speaker A:Yes.
Speaker A:Who is one of the more intriguing athletes.
Speaker A:You're going to get great performances from those women that we mentioned before.
Speaker A:But Julie Darin, she's done one Ironman I think.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:I had even forgotten that she had qualified and it was earlier in the year where she won a Race with not a great pro field.
Speaker A:I don't know, she wasn't a stack.
Speaker B:Field, but still it's very impressive.
Speaker B:And then we've got Solvag Lobset, the Norwegian.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah, that's right.
Speaker B:So that's right.
Speaker B:The woman who won another.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:And we're talking about these women in particular.
Speaker A:And you wonder, like, how is this gonna.
Speaker A:How is this race gonna play out?
Speaker A:Because a lot of these athletes have similar strengths, but then stacked up against the whole field.
Speaker A:There's just differences there.
Speaker A:Like, you have Lucy Charles, Barclay, you've got Taylor Nib, who are more athletes who are going to fight from the front, going to push it from the front.
Speaker A:But then you have Laura Phillip, Kat Matthews, who are going to be coming on more in the back half on the bike, in the run, plus someone like Solvag and Julie Darren, you wonder, could there be, you know, this distinct packs coming off the bike, but just close enough where they could coalesce on the run?
Speaker B:Yeah, it's.
Speaker B:Again, that one is a full month after nice.
Speaker B:So we will have a.
Speaker B:A month to digest and talk about nice and then prep ourselves for this race in Kona.
Speaker B:But already just salivating at these incredible fields of talent.
Speaker B:I would argue that these are the most talented deep fields on both sides.
Speaker B:We've heard every year we do that.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Just because of the nature of the field.
Speaker B:I feel like every year the men's field or the women's field is just amazing.
Speaker B:But to see both of them this deep and this impressive is.
Speaker B:It just strikes me as really great.
Speaker B:It's a great sign for the pro ranks.
Speaker B:It's a great sign for where we are as a sport in terms of how much talent there is right now.
Speaker B:So I think it's pretty cool.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And I wrote this in a newsletter, like, it just seems like everybody's healthy as well.
Speaker A:Like, generally it seems like people are healthy.
Speaker A:If they aren't, then they're obviously hiding it well.
Speaker A:All the big names seem to be healthy, ready to go.
Speaker A:Another thing that I wrote was with the men's and the women's fields, the men's, I think it will be great racing, but there's almost somewhat of inevitability where you're just like, how can anyone really beat Christian if he's fully on his game like he has been?
Speaker A:Whereas the women, it just seems so wide open.
Speaker A:If different things happen, you could easily have somebody else win.
Speaker A:To me, if I'm looking at these two races, both incredibly sacked, best ever.
Speaker A:I'm more looking forward to the women's race.
Speaker B:Yeah, interesting.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker B:We will see.
Speaker B:We only have to wait a short month or so.
Speaker B:25 days.
Speaker B:25 days.
Speaker B:All right, we'll see.
Speaker B:We will be talking about this again, I'm sure, because as the race gets closer, I'm sure there'll be more news about it.
Speaker B:What are your thoughts, listeners?
Speaker B:You should let us know on the Talk Tempo Talks Facebook group.
Speaker B:We would love to hear your thoughts.
Speaker B:If you're not a member, just take a quick search in that little magnifying glass for Tempo talks.
Speaker B:You'll find us answer the easy questions.
Speaker B:We'll gain you admittance.
Speaker B:We'd be love to hear your thoughts and answer any other questions that you might have around triathlon and around the podcast.
Speaker B:Let's move on to our second topic which is a spot of bad news for T100.
Speaker B:After coming off of that really sensational weekend in London where seemed like once again the momentum was high.
Speaker B:Vancouver, everything was great out of Vancouver and I can't remember what the story was, but something not so great happened.
Speaker B:And then everything was great coming out of London.
Speaker B:And then all of a sudden we hear this story out of Valencia where where initially there was an announcement that the race that was a co race between the World triathlon organization and T100 had to be cancelled.
Speaker B:And I wasn't terribly surprised at first because that area was hit so hard by those floods last year and there was all this question about construction.
Speaker B:And I remember talking to you when they announced it, this didn't make a whole lot of sense to choose that location.
Speaker B:Now it turns out it had nothing to do with construction.
Speaker B:It had to do with the fact that the T100 and the WTO either couldn't afford or didn't secure the permits.
Speaker B:Not really.
Speaker B:It sounds like a money issue.
Speaker A:It's a money issue.
Speaker B:Given the fact that just given the fact they just had this huge injection of cash.
Speaker B:This is not a good look.
Speaker A:It's not a good look.
Speaker A:And maybe we can rewind.
Speaker A:So Vancouver was an exceptional race.
Speaker A:First time you literally had orcas swimming along the buoys.
Speaker A:Incredible marketing opportunity.
Speaker A:And then I think it was the thing after that was the news on they hadn't paid their athletes or whatever and they finally were able to pay them.
Speaker A:And then I think after that it was, I think the injection of money from the Saudis whatnot and then London.
Speaker B:So they were back on, which was a plus minus.
Speaker B:Yeah, that was a plus minus.
Speaker B:Saudi money.
Speaker A:They needed that money though, for sure.
Speaker A:To pay those athletes.
Speaker A:And now, yes, we are back in the wind.
Speaker A:Out of the sails, alum.
Speaker A:I feel like with this situation it's not just T100, it's also involves world triathlon.
Speaker A:So I feel like they almost get a bit of a, I don't know, a break on this.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:I don't cut them some.
Speaker B:Look.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:I just feel like you've got to be looking for your wins and you've got to be putting together a series of like positives and I don't care whose fault it is, you're associated with it.
Speaker B:It's bad optics yet.
Speaker B:And I just, I don't know, it's.
Speaker B:Every time they seem to be getting their wheels moving in the right direction, they get another flat.
Speaker B:And a lot of the times they're getting a flat because they left the tax on the garage floor.
Speaker A:Exactly, yeah, yeah.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So it's a lot of self inflicted wounds here and it just, I don't know.
Speaker B:Look, Sam Ranuf has been the CEO through all of this.
Speaker B:Does the buck not stop with the CEO?
Speaker B:Everybody used a dump on Andrew Messick regardless of whether or not it was his fault.
Speaker B:I don't hear people dumping on Sam Ranuf and I don't really get why not.
Speaker B:Because to me he wants to be the face of the T100 then he needs to own this stuff and I don't see him really owning it and say we're going to do better.
Speaker B:He doesn't do that.
Speaker B:He just comes out and celebrates all the wins and then disappears when any of the bad stuff.
Speaker A:That's interesting.
Speaker A:It's almost like public perception plays a role here.
Speaker A:Right?
Speaker A:Iron man, they're not the type of organization to make mistakes, to really cancel races.
Speaker A:Yes, they screw up at times, but they're held to a very high standard.
Speaker A:And whereas the T100, because of so many slip ups over the years and.
Speaker B:Whatnot, it's almost like it's.
Speaker A:There's an expectation, different expectations.
Speaker A:Like if you're Sam Ranuf, you can get away almost with these things because people are like, ah, it's just T100, look at them again.
Speaker A:It's a double standard.
Speaker B:It's a double standard.
Speaker B:Sure.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:I guess it's also, listen, it's also why I have not yet signed up for a T100 race because I just don't trust it's gonna happen.
Speaker B:I just, I feel like I have.
Speaker B:You could say what you want about Ironman and people will say all the things that they do want they say it all the time and a lot of it, some of it has merit, some of it doesn't.
Speaker B:There's no question they're expensive races, blah blah, blah.
Speaker B:But you know what, you get what you pay for and I show up.
Speaker A:And generally you do that.
Speaker B:I know exactly what I'm going to get.
Speaker B:It always comes.
Speaker B:I get exactly what I'm expecting.
Speaker B:I have a good experience and if things happen that are out of their control, water conditions and the swim has to be canceled or whatever, I give them a pass because they can't control that.
Speaker B:But these T100 things, like I said, so many of them seem self inflicted and I really think it's unfortunate because like you said, that Vancouver race looked great, the San Francisco race looked great, the London race, except for the finish area looked great.
Speaker B:But they just keep unfortunately lowering the bar for themselves and it does nothing but good things for triathlon to have more positives with these two organizations.
Speaker B:So I'd like to see them be more successful on a regular basis.
Speaker A:Yeah, and to me definitely a red flag of all this is the fact that they are working with world or they're supposed to be working with World Triathlon on this.
Speaker A:And World Triathlon would be an organization held to that Ironman standard in a way.
Speaker A:Like they're not usually ones to cancel races willy nilly or whatnot.
Speaker A:Whereas now that they've signed this 12 year memorandum of understanding or agreement or whatever with T100 deepening ties, it seems like they are almost falling to the level of T100 in this situation, which is troubling.
Speaker B:Yeah, World Triathlon doesn't.
Speaker B:I think I could be wrong but it seems to be a World Triathlon doesn't have the same kind of footprint here in North America as Ironman does.
Speaker B:And so I think when people hear World Triathlon and this combined race fails, I don't think too many people are thinking it's a World Triathlon issue.
Speaker B:I could be wrong again.
Speaker B:But to me I think this is a T100 thing because there's the organization.
Speaker B:I know better.
Speaker B:Now I know what you're saying.
Speaker B:World Triathlon is the older, more established and they are organization, it's a proper institution.
Speaker B:They're like the UCI, right?
Speaker A:Yes, exactly.
Speaker A:They're a sport governing body I guess is what the term would be.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:But I don't usually think like the UCI.
Speaker B:I think of as a like for people who don't know that's the governing body for professional cycling.
Speaker B:The UCI doesn't put on races.
Speaker B:They Sanction the races or they have something to do with oversight.
Speaker B:But they don't put on the Tour de France, they don't put on the Vuelta.
Speaker B:They don't put on these things.
Speaker B:So when I think of World Triathlon, it's a little unusual for me to think of them putting on events.
Speaker B:So that's why I don't necessarily totally think of them that way.
Speaker B:And they certainly do.
Speaker B:They put on events in North America.
Speaker A:No, they don't.
Speaker A:But.
Speaker A:And this is the thing, like World Triathlon itself, I guess they would.
Speaker A:They don't put on events.
Speaker A:They have local organizing committees who put on.
Speaker A:Who like do everything with the events.
Speaker A:And so that was the problem with this race.
Speaker A:Like the local organizing committee in Valencia, made up of whoever.
Speaker A:Like they didn't have the money in the end, but like, when would you have figured out you didn't have the money?
Speaker A:Is this something that happened in the last month or is this something that happened earlier?
Speaker A:And it just seems weird that this isn't something that would happen a month out to me anyways.
Speaker A:Unless no one was just checking the bank account or something.
Speaker B:Oh, it's a very.
Speaker B:It's a very Monty Python esque sort of thing.
Speaker B:I could imagine this room of people talking about different languages to each other.
Speaker B:They're all speaking Spanish, but they're speaking in completely different.
Speaker B:Like they're not understanding each other.
Speaker B:And somebody finally was like, wait a minute, we don't have any money.
Speaker A:Exactly.
Speaker A:Trying to do all these things.
Speaker A:It's, oh, wait, we can't actually pay for this.
Speaker A:And one of the things now too is the World Triathlon World cup race is canceled.
Speaker A:The T100 is supposed to be relocated to another location, but.
Speaker B:Yeah, but when, When, I mean that all those athletes are like travel.
Speaker A:It's like a month away, less than a month away from the originally schedul day.
Speaker A:Like surely they have to make the call that's not happening in the next little bit, surely.
Speaker B:Yeah, I know.
Speaker B:And that's just really disappointing.
Speaker B:And it's.
Speaker B:Even if they tried to put it on, how good of an event are they going to be able to put on last minute?
Speaker A:Exactly.
Speaker B:Unless they go back to Ibiza.
Speaker B:They're going to go back to Ibiza again.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:Anyways, all right, I think we've done that one to death, but I'm sure it won't be the last time we're talking about T100 again.
Speaker B:They are always good for now.
Speaker A:They're due for now.
Speaker A:They're due for a Good thing, because they just had a bad thing.
Speaker A:So the next thing's going to be good.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker B:Alright, let's move on to our third topic.
Speaker B:And that is an article that you brought to my attention and I think it's an interesting one.
Speaker B:It was written by Alex Hutchinson, who is a physiologist who generally writes fantastic articles.
Speaker B:If you're not familiar with his work, I believe his, his regular column is called Sweat Science and it's always very informational and very interesting and stimulating to think about.
Speaker B:He has an article that just came out that says new evidence that long, slow discovery resistance is the key to endurance success.
Speaker B:And basically what he does is he synthesizes an article that just was published.
Speaker B:I'm trying to find where it was published.
Speaker B:A new study in the International Journal of Sports Physiology and Performance.
Speaker B:And basically it was sports scientists from Holland, the Netherlands, they looked at training and racing data from professional women cyclists and found that the women who trained more did better than the women who trained less in their races.
Speaker B:They tended to have better results.
Speaker B:But when they looked at what the breakdown of their hours were that they were training, the women who trained more tended to train more in Zone one and Zone two.
Speaker B:And so the conclusion seemed to be, oh, what you need for success then is not to train more.
Speaker B:You need to train more in zone one and Zone two.
Speaker B:And that is where I felt like, what did you make that conclusion?
Speaker A:Yeah, I'm confused a little bit.
Speaker A:So they're basically saying, if you have a given amount of time, just do Zone one, Zone two, that will.
Speaker B:All right, so here's how it looked.
Speaker B:So the women who were less successful and again, less successful, these are professional cyclists, so they're still much more successful than the average bear.
Speaker B:So less successful.
Speaker B:They averaged out to about 443 hours of training over a season.
Speaker B:And they broke that down to about 178 of those hours were zone one, zone two.
Speaker B:So just under half, 106 of those hours or about a quarter were in zone three.
Speaker B:And then a very small amount, 42 hours in zone four, and then smaller amounts in five and six.
Speaker B:And then there's 81 hours that were just not accounted for.
Speaker B:I'm not sure what those hours were.
Speaker B:And then when they looked at the more, the highly successful group, they trained for 563 hours.
Speaker B:So 120 hours more.
Speaker B:And they had 244 hours in zone one two, 154 hours in zone three, and then 50 hours.
Speaker B:So basically the marginal increases, if you look at percentage wise, they stayed pretty similar in terms of their percentage time in zone the higher zones, they slightly increased their percentage of time in zone three, but they really had a big increase in zone one and two.
Speaker B:And so what Alex's interpretation and what the scientists interpretation, who did the paper was it's not a matter of doing more high hard training, it's just a matter of doing easy, more easy training.
Speaker B:And I'm like, that's one interpretation.
Speaker B:My interpretation from looking at this is train more and you'll do better now when you train less.
Speaker B:Now we've talked about this before, you and I as a professional.
Speaker B:You have a whole lot of hours that you can train.
Speaker B:You're going to be doing a whole lot of those hours in zone one, Zone two, you're going to be doing a percentage of those hours in zone 3 and above.
Speaker B:Whereas for someone like me who's got a significant budgetary restriction on my hours, yeah, I also try to get about 50% in zone one, zone two, but, but I need to make sure that I'm getting a higher amount of intensity.
Speaker B:And so just by virtue of the fact that I have to be doing intensity and I believe that intensity is benefiting me and I know that it is because there's lots of literature to show that it is, then it's going to take up fractionally more of my time.
Speaker B:Like it did in these athletes who were quote unquote less successful.
Speaker B:They had a higher percentage of their time was in the higher zones.
Speaker B:I don't think it's fair to say that if you have a higher, they didn't have a gigantic amount of hours in those high zones.
Speaker B:They had actually very similar amount of hours.
Speaker B:All it just because they had less hours to train, it ends up looking like a bigger percentage.
Speaker B:And my own feeling is that the benefit they get from those harder workouts is still there and it's very important.
Speaker B:But if they could do more hours, they would be, it would behoove them to do them as longer, easier workouts.
Speaker B:And you tell me what is your week of probably it's got to be double what I do.
Speaker B:What is, what does your week look like?
Speaker B:It's probably similar to what these highly successful athletes look like, I'd wager.
Speaker A:Yeah, it is like you really in a lot of ways physiologically have a cap, I think on the intensity.
Speaker A:You can do that really high intensity training because the recovery time is just, is so much more.
Speaker A:Whereas if you have available time, you can fill it with that Zone one, Zone two and you can fill it in a lot.
Speaker A:If obviously you're fueling well, hydrating, recovering well, that kind of stuff, you can really smash those kind of hours too.
Speaker A:So it's just funny.
Speaker A:Of course they're going to be better results.
Speaker A:They're literally just training more.
Speaker A:And the reason they're training more from what we know is because they're just doing more of the Zone one, Zone two training, which you can do without potentially injuring yourself or over training or whatever.
Speaker B:And I think it's important to note that they had 50% more hours in zone three and they had an additional about 25, less than 25, maybe 20% more hours in zone four.
Speaker B:So the athletes who were training more were 100% adding more hours to those higher zones as well.
Speaker B:So could you just completely ignore.
Speaker A:So could you claim also based on the findings that if you spend more time in zone three, you're going to be more successful technically?
Speaker B:I think so.
Speaker B:I think you could.
Speaker B:I think it's a very strange take home to look at these graphs and say, oh, all you have to do is train more Zone one, Zone two and you'll be better.
Speaker B:And I'm like, yeah, if you could train more then you'll be better.
Speaker A:He was on a deadline.
Speaker B:Yes, of course.
Speaker B:Listen, I love Alex for sure, I love Alex.
Speaker B:And I think, and I think Alex is.
Speaker B:And this is.
Speaker B: Look, we've talked about: Speaker B: ly restricted on hours, doing: Speaker B:If you've got 10 hours a week to train and only two of your hours are at any kind of intensity, that's not going to make you very competitive.
Speaker B:And I'm sorry, but that's just the truth.
Speaker B: o end up not being able to do: Speaker B:So the best way to be competitive.
Speaker B:Exactly.
Speaker B:The best way to be competitive is not be time starved, be able to train more easy.
Speaker B:I think we all know that.
Speaker A:Yeah, I guess.
Speaker A:And like looking at this, I probably maybe asked you this before but like for your athletes, let's say they're like, they're having a tough day or something works, they're really taking it out of them.
Speaker A:They go to do this workout that they have prescribed and they don't feel like they can do it because it's very high intensity and they're just not up to it.
Speaker A:It's still better in that case to just dial back the intensity to zone one.
Speaker A:Zone two.
Speaker A:Is that better than doing nothing?
Speaker B:Oh, yeah.
Speaker B:Oh, for sure.
Speaker A:But even if they can't hit that intensity, it's still.
Speaker A:It's still going out there and doing a spin.
Speaker B:Absolutely.
Speaker B:And I want them to tell me that.
Speaker B:And they say, look, if for whatever reason I'm training fatigue or work fatigue or lack of sleep or whatever, I just don't feel like I can hit this high intensity workout today.
Speaker B:That's my job as their coach to look at their schedule for the rest of the week and say, okay, I'm going to move things around for you.
Speaker B:Let's still try to get this workout in, but I'm going to move it to later in the week.
Speaker B:Let's have an easy day today.
Speaker B:And sometimes it doesn't work.
Speaker B:Sometimes I can't find a way to get this workout in.
Speaker B:And I'll say, okay, fine, we're just gonna bag it this week and that's all right.
Speaker B:And I try very hard to make my athletes understand that missing one high intensity workout is just not going to.
Speaker B:It's not gonna scuttle all the hard work you've been doing as long as.
Speaker B:If we can get in something, then that's great.
Speaker B:And if you can't get it in because life is in the way, that's okay too.
Speaker B:Too.
Speaker B:That's okay, too.
Speaker B:It's going to be okay.
Speaker B:And I'm interested when you compare yourself to Kirsten, who's training for short course is you're probably training similar hours, I would imagine.
Speaker A:Yeah, she's still coming back from her surgery and stuff.
Speaker A:But like when both training.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:Pretty similar hours for sure.
Speaker A:I'd say maybe she was doing a little bit more than me last year when she was really in that Olympic build.
Speaker A:For sure.
Speaker B:And would you say the breakdown between the easier stuff and the intense stuff or what does it look like for you guys and is it similar between for you and for her?
Speaker A:I feel like she would have slightly more intensity in that ratio, but not even that much more really at the end of the day when you're.
Speaker A:If you're doing pro hours, let's say a lot of your time is doing zone two because you can just rack those up miles up without the risk of injury or over training or whatever.
Speaker B:And we have to remember that for a pro, Zone two is.
Speaker A:It's like hours still be not.
Speaker A:Yeah, it could still Be hard in some ways for sure.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker B:The conversation with Patty Pagacha.
Speaker B:Have you seen that interview where he's talking about, oh, I love to go out there and ride those five hour easy rides.
Speaker B:And the interviewer is like, what does that mean?
Speaker B:And he's 350 watts.
Speaker A:Did he just put that out there just to say that?
Speaker A:Because that's wild stuff.
Speaker A:That blew up the interview.
Speaker A:And maybe he knew what he was doing.
Speaker B:He's trolling the rest of the world.
Speaker A:He won the tour when he made that comment because everybody got that on blast.
Speaker A:All his competition, they were like, holy crap, this guy's doing that.
Speaker A:So a little information warfare maybe.
Speaker A:Who knows?
Speaker B:Oh, Matt, we're gonna ask all of the listeners to lobby you for the Marbella.
Speaker A:You'll do a poll in the group.
Speaker B:Should Matt go to Marbella and join Jeff and Triathlon Joe?
Speaker B:And I think Brian's going.
Speaker B:Brian.
Speaker A:Okay, yeah.
Speaker A:If Br Going, then I'm definitely going.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker B:There will be opportunities for everybody to voice their opinion on this, and we look forward to hearing what your thoughts are.
Speaker B:Matt, it's been another good conversation.
Speaker B:I've enjoyed it.
Speaker A:Yes, thank you, thank you.
Speaker A:And I'll see you out there, maybe in Marbella.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker B:Yeah, before then, for sure.
Speaker B:All right, take care, everyone.
Speaker B:Thanks for listening.
Speaker B:We appreciate it.
Speaker B:And don't forget to leave a rating and a review wherever you download the content.
Speaker B:It means a lot to us.
Speaker B:And don't forget, tell a friend, get them on board.
Speaker B:We'll see you next week on Tempo Talks.
